Gun Control & RKBA

discntnt_irny_srcsm

(18,692 posts)

84. Many folks are "in love" with the idea that...

Fri Aug 4, 2017, 04:19 PM

Aug 2017

...a new law, stricter law, better law... is the answer to mostly all problems facing society. The problem there comes from the fact that some of those folks are law makers and law makers have a bit more to say about making laws than most of us. Unfortunately, the old saying, 'when all you have is a hammer, everything starts to look like a nail' plays a big role in legislation.

I would hazard a guess that many laws, which were written and passed with the best intentions, have taken unintended turns and have actually caused problems for the people.

Many folks want to end around any state government and have the feds make it law from sea to shining sea.

Good intentions will always be pleaded for every assumption of authority. It is hardly too strong to say that the Constitution was made to guard the people against the dangers of good intentions. There are men in all ages who mean to govern well, but they mean to govern. They promise to be good masters, but they mean to be masters. - Daniel Webster

Sound like any orange person you may have heard of?

"The right of the citizens to keep and bear arms has justly been considered, as the palladium of the liberties of a republic; since it offers a strong moral check against the usurpation and arbitrary power of rulers; and will generally, even if these are successful in the first instance, enable the people to resist and triumph over them." - (Story, Joseph. Commentaries on the Constitution of the United States. 3 vols. Boston, 1833.) (Joseph Story (September 18, 1779 – September 10, 1845) was an American lawyer and jurist who served on the Supreme Court of the United States from 1811 to 1845.)

What would that fellow, Story, know about the law? Why should his opinion on the Constitution be worth anything more than that of a bloke in the pub on the next stool? Is there any reason to trust the opinion of someone who was alive when the BoR was written and passed?

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What did the Founders mean... [View all] discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 OP

Post removed Post removed Jun 2017 #1

Having defeated the army of the greatest colonial power on the planet Warpy Jun 2017 #2

Good list discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #3

So the French Navy was just there for show? Funny, I could've sworn it was them who ensured victory. malchickiwick Jun 2017 #4

Just because the founding fathers thought something Eko Jun 2017 #5

US history is rife with examples of our leaders' mistakes and even crimes discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #10

Nor Eko Jun 2017 #15

re: "...using a conclusion that is over 200 years old..." discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #16

What would the modern day reason be? Eko Jun 2017 #17

This reply doesn't say anything about your thoughts on the subject... discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #18

Sorry, Eko Jun 2017 #20

I replied to your 37% issue discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #21

I think Eko Jun 2017 #22

I prefer the Swiss arrangement for militia service... discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #35

just a few things, gejohnston Jun 2017 #23

Sure, Eko Jun 2017 #24

Did you also note that 'everyone' else who isn't in the NG, is also a member of the militia? jmg257 Jun 2017 #28

You mean Eko Jun 2017 #29

Yep back to the whole age & sex thing. jmg257 Jun 2017 #30

Don't you know... discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #36

And this Eko Jun 2017 #25

yes I know, but gejohnston Jun 2017 #32

Do gun laws affect Eko Jun 2017 #26

what difference does the weapon make gejohnston Jun 2017 #31

only the bayonet knows what it is about jimmy the one Jul 2017 #38

I was refering to what was available on the commercial market vs gejohnston Jul 2017 #49

eli whitney's cotton gun jimmy the one Jul 2017 #60

not relevant, since modern firearms are gejohnston Jul 2017 #61

memory head jimmy the one Jul 2017 #64

Yes, and the sources you do cite gejohnston Jul 2017 #68

broken lamp, broken man jimmy the one Jul 2017 #70

your rant is nonsense gejohnston Jul 2017 #71

decked out jimmy the one Jul 2017 #72

Who you? gejohnston Jul 2017 #73

Conventional wisdom 'almost always wrong'? readers agree? jimmy the one Jul 2017 #74

you are the one making cheap shots logical fallacies gejohnston Jul 2017 #75

spinning like a top jimmy the one Jul 2017 #66

and? gejohnston Jul 2017 #69

Face the facts, more guns more gun crime/deaths jimmy the one Jul 2017 #62

cite your sources, gejohnston Jul 2017 #63

sources jimmy the one Jul 2017 #65

The fact check article gejohnston Jul 2017 #67

conventional wisdom is usually spot on jimmy the one Aug 2017 #92

Meh- a prolix, badly formatted argumentum ad populum *and* sheer Colonism: friendly_iconoclast Aug 2017 #93

advocatus diabolicon jimmy the one Aug 2017 #94

Conventional wisdom is like a factoid gejohnston Aug 2017 #98

argumentum reddum herringum jimmy the one Aug 2017 #99

I stand by the observation that "conventional wisdom" is usually wrong gejohnston Aug 2017 #100

I see ipsedixitism is now sharing space with 'proof by assertion' friendly_iconoclast Aug 2017 #101

As far as heroin vs guns Eko Jun 2017 #27

Drug overdose deaths in 2016 most likely exceeded 59,000 hack89 Jun 2017 #33

How is it defining drug poisonings gejohnston Jun 2017 #34

I don't know that many people doubt the intent of the 2nd Amendment. pablo_marmol Jun 2017 #6

The government "...derives its just powers from the consent of the governed..." n/t discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #11

Fo sho. pablo_marmol Jun 2017 #19

Well, that's a wise question to ask. discntnt_irny_srcsm Jul 2017 #79

"I suggest that they read........" pablo_marmol Aug 2017 #81

There is disagreement about the meaning of MichMary Jul 2017 #76

"Well regulated", yagotme Aug 2017 #80

"There is disagreement......." pablo_marmol Aug 2017 #82

History is filled with examples of people oppressed by Leaders who abuse their power MedusaX Jun 2017 #7

Those who believe that the 2A isn't really a right... discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #12

I can't say it better than most of the posters above have already said, but will add Alea Jun 2017 #8

I think Heraclitus had the numbers about right concerning battle discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #13

WHO expects american militias to provide their own arms? jimmy the one Jul 2017 #51

You must have had a hard time posting here when the italics button was broken Alea Jul 2017 #54

paranoia, big destroya jimmy the one Jul 2017 #59

Generally, Hamilton is good on this, yet his notion of a select militia didn't come about for jmg257 Jun 2017 #9

Of the mistakes made here... discntnt_irny_srcsm Jun 2017 #14

cannot have it both ways; the unorg'd militia is a JOKE jimmy the one Jul 2017 #37

Not really arguing anything, Jim - pointing out it is quite easy to know what the founders meant jmg257 Jul 2017 #40

You have the right to own any weapon manufactured before 1792 Doug.Goodall Jul 2017 #39

You have the right to express your opinion using any method available before 1792 friendly_iconoclast Jul 2017 #41

Regulation? You mean like FCC, Post Office Doug.Goodall Jul 2017 #43

If that's true, then why aren't single shot firearms recommended over "self loading" models... Marengo Jul 2017 #45

"...(S)omething we do not need in modern society" Would that be the royal 'we', or... friendly_iconoclast Jul 2017 #46

You just reminded me of why I do not post in this group Doug.Goodall Jul 2017 #52

On the contrary, your opinion is among those most valuable here. discntnt_irny_srcsm Jul 2017 #53

None of the 3 things you listed have any bearing on the post you replied to. Alea Jul 2017 #56

A) GC&RKBA is not an 'amen chorus', and B) none of that bears upon what I posted friendly_iconoclast Jul 2017 #58

Your opinion is welcome, however it is nonsensical and there is no obligation for anyone to accept.. Marengo Jul 2017 #55

Thanks for the reply and welcome to the group discntnt_irny_srcsm Jul 2017 #42

I thought cannon were crew served weapons Doug.Goodall Jul 2017 #44

"Revolvers are for people who display poor marksmanship or who intend to kill multiple times." friendly_iconoclast Jul 2017 #47

re: cannon discntnt_irny_srcsm Jul 2017 #48

If you want to own artillery, all it takes is money. oneshooter Jul 2017 #50

Should the government prevent the ownership of word processing software? It postdates 1793... Marengo Jul 2017 #57

So, you're ok with me having a 20 shot semi-auto .68 caliber rifle then? AtheistCrusader Aug 2017 #95

Only if it is NOT a muzzle loader. oneshooter Aug 2017 #96

I was thinking Girandoni repeating rifle, but yes. AtheistCrusader Aug 2017 #97

The amendments in the Bill of Rights MichMary Jul 2017 #77

Welcome to the group discntnt_irny_srcsm Jul 2017 #78

Amazing that restriction supporters can't grasp this. pablo_marmol Aug 2017 #83

Many folks are "in love" with the idea that... discntnt_irny_srcsm Aug 2017 #84

Well oneshooter Aug 2017 #85

I suppose the best course... discntnt_irny_srcsm Aug 2017 #86

Love that sarcasm but more points discntnt_irny_srcsm Aug 2017 #88

On 'good intentions'........ pablo_marmol Aug 2017 #87

"When you disarm the people... discntnt_irny_srcsm Aug 2017 #89

Perfect! And this is yet another point that restriction supporters will never grasp. pablo_marmol Aug 2017 #90

My favorite Ann Richards quote: discntnt_irny_srcsm Aug 2017 #91

2nd amendment mythology re: ann richards texas gov jimmy the one Aug 2017 #102