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Emrys

(8,768 posts)
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 11:02 PM 12 hrs ago

White House Scrambles to Quell Rumors of Russia-Friendly Donbas Proposal

Source: Kyiv Post

A swirl of speculation around a purported US-Russia peace blueprint that would hand Moscow full control of the eastern Donbas and force Ukraine to cut its military in half jolted Washington and European capitals on Wednesday.

But officials on both sides of the Atlantic are scrambling to put distance between themselves and the alleged plan, refusing to confirm whether anything resembling the proposal exists.

One senior US official, speaking on background, brushed off the document as a "maximalist Kremlin fantasy," the kind of outlandish wishlist Washington believes Moscow circulates to test Western nerves.
...
Across Europe, skepticism hardened into outright scorn. Several Western diplomats described the rumor mill as yet another attempt by Moscow to manufacture momentum for a deal that Kyiv would never accept and the West would never endorse.

The mood in Brussels, Berlin and Paris leaned more toward annoyance than alarm, with diplomats calling the entire episode a "familiar Russian parlor trick."

Read more: https://www.kyivpost.com/post/64561



The "Exclusive" story about the supposed "28-point plan" to end the Russia-Ukraine war - effectively a Putinite wet dream - published earlier today by Reuters was based on anonymous sources cited by the media outlet Axios, as covered in this earlier LBN post: https://www.democraticunderground.com/10143568149

That article's title alone, "Ukraine expected to give up land, some arms under US peace plan, sources say", was (deliberately?) ambiguous - did "expected" mean it was being predicted to happen, or that such a demand was being made of Ukraine?

Whatever, severe skepticism about Axios's and Reuters' story isn't confined to the Ukrainian media - a number of journalists specializing in Russian affairs see it as a typical ploy by the Putin regime (aided by its fellow travellers in the US government and some of the non-Russian media) to stir things up and sow confusion as its economy goes down the tubes and Trump once again grows restless about his inability to deliver yet another war solved to add to his mounting (in his head) toll.

For instance, I'll focus on journalist and author Michael Weiss, posting on Twitter (he doesn't have any other online outlet except Substack), who catches the zeitgeist among many who have long familiarity with Russian propaganda techniques. Here are a few of his recent tweets on this subject:

Michael Weiss
@michaeldweiss

Dmitriev and Dim Philby scheming again: https://archive.ph/EryYr



(Dim Philby is Weiss's nickname for Witkoff. Dmitriev didn't spend three days with Witkoff & co. in Miami, as any competent journalist might have thought to check before publishing, but seemingly Axios doesn't have any of those.)

Michael Weiss
@michaeldweiss

Peskov sprinkling cold water on Dmitriev's efforts: https://www.nytimes.com/2025/11/19/world/europe/ukraine-russia-strikes-peace-talks.html



Michael Weiss
@michaeldweiss

Looks like Steve Witkoff tweeted what was meant to be a DM, saying the content for this much-discussed Axios story must have come from "K." Almost certainly this refers to Kirill Dmitriev, who is quoted in the story. But it seems the Russian side is leaking this for a reason. Also seems Dim Philby doesn't know how Twitter works, but is nonetheless confident of his ability to end the war.



Michael Weiss
@michaeldweiss

An essential point many are missing. Ze was politically much stronger when he tried the Steinmeier formula and then caved due to domestic political pressure. Now? Good luck saying Donbas is Russia.

Yaroslav Trofimov
@yarotrof

Zelensky's standing is precarious amid the corruption scandal as even some of his party's MPs demand the firing of Yermak and a unity government with the anti-Russian parts of the opposition. This moment of weakness means that the last thing Zelensky can afford politically at home is to agree to the concessions of the supposed Witkoff-Dmitriev plan, whatever they are. Being seen to buckle to Russian demands because his buddies were just caught stuffing their pockets would be political death.


Michael Weiss
@michaeldweiss

Yermak being seen as close to Witkoff is a very good way to make Yermak even more embattled in Ukraine. https://x.com/olliecarroll/s/olliecarroll/status/1991077056474497465

Oliver Carroll @olliecarroll
Zelensky's embattled chief-of-staff Andrii Yermak confirms attendance at talks in Turkey. Claims all planned meetings will go ahead. But pointedly notes "constant contact" with Special Rep Witkoff and White House. I.e. short of face-to-face meeting that had been planned. x.com/andriyyermak/s...


Michael Weiss
@michaeldweiss

So more of the same. Also, they're asking Ukraine to neuter itself militarily at precisely the time Driscoll, Donahue and George are traveling to Kyiv to discuss (among other things) Ukrainian weapons production and Trump has signaled his desire to acquire Ukrainian drones. https://x.com/christopherjm/

Christopher Miller
@ChristopherJM

New: I can confirm a hasty US-Russia proposal being pushed to Ukrainians via Dmitriev-Witkoff to Umerov. It would amount to Ukraine's capitulation, with people familiar telling me it's merely the Kremlin's maximalist demands.
Includes:
-Ukraine army cut in half
-Give up certain weapons
-Give up Donbas
-Zelensky displeased
More tk @FT


Michael Weiss
@michaeldweiss

"No foreign diplomatic planes" sounds like an SVR joke thrown in just to see what kind of crazy shit they can get away with at this point.


Michael Weiss
@michaeldweiss

Sounds like Dmitriev and Witkoff are trying to will into existence Russia's maximalist demands, and opportunistically seizing on Russian battlefield gains and Ukraine's corruption crisis. One U.S. government source tells me: "This is a joke and has no chance of succeeding. These are terms the U.S. has already rejected several times." https://x.com/olliecarroll/s

Oliver Carroll
@olliecarroll

My understanding of hashed US-Russian peace plan. As ugly as you'd expect:
-- Ukr army 2.5 x reduction. Only Ukr army. Note: not 2x as speculated
-- No foreign troops in Ukraine
-- No foreign diplomatic planes in Ukraine
-- Ban on long range weapons that can reach ST P, Mos


Michael Weiss
@michaeldweiss

This reporting is matching much of what I'm getting from the American side. Conflating Witkoff's cocktail napkin jottings with some official "U.S. government" line is what the Russians want. Many will oblige.

Alex Wickham
@alexwickham

NEW: European officials say Russia is once again trying to play the US and Steve Witkoff with new 'talks' on Ukraine.

Some reports in the US today suggested a new US-Russia peace plan could bring a deal 'within days'.

But sources in Europe are expressing a lot of scepticism, noting we've been here before with Witkoff and Russia and it's fallen apart.

Europe is not involved in these talks. It's unclear who on the US side is backing them. It looks like another Witkoff-Dmitriev idea that concedes to Russian demands.

European sources also stress that as ever there should be a massive health warning on anything Dmitriev says.

Europeans note that Russia is desperate to avoid US sanctions and whenever it comes under economic pressure it pretends to the US it's interested in a deal.

Russian fuel shipments in the first half of November fell to the lowest since the invasion of Ukraine began, a further sign that sanctions are hurting.

And they say there remains no indication that Putin has moved from his same maximalist demands.

It's another lurch on the rollercoaster but cold water poured on the idea anything major has yet changed or is imminent. The 'plan' is ultimately only going to go anywhere if Trump / Rubio / Ukraine all back it and there's no indication yet on any of those.


Michael Weiss reposted

Kateryna Lisunova @KaterynaLis

More and more sources suggest that the so‑called Dmitriev-Witkoff "peace plan" is nothing more than a deliberate Russian leak meant to exploit a moment of vulnerability for Ukraine. This is described in detail in a publication by @SergiyKyslytsya, First Deputy Foreign Minister and former Ukrainian Ambassador to the United Nations.

"I'm reading about some 'plans' here, and at least two things come to mind: Gosplan -- the State Planning Committee of the USSR, a factory of unrealistic plans -- and IPSYOP, Information Psychological Operations, meaning the planned manipulation of information to influence people's thoughts and emotions. This is different from ordinary fakes because it's deliberate and goal-driven. It's also used to sow panic and divide society. So they hype up today rumors about "plans", one says?"
4 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
Highlight: NoneDon't highlight anything 5 newestHighlight 5 most recent replies
White House Scrambles to Quell Rumors of Russia-Friendly Donbas Proposal (Original Post) Emrys 12 hrs ago OP
Trump still working for Putin. Nothing has changed, but the question remains....why? OAITW r.2.0 12 hrs ago #1
Apparently Zelensky showed up just long enough to say no Warpy 9 hrs ago #2
Too late. Baitball Blogger 4 hrs ago #3
Wouldn't surprise me at all to find that King Fat Pig came up with the idea then TACO'd when his aides said he was nuts! Wonder Why 30 min ago #4

Warpy

(114,217 posts)
2. Apparently Zelensky showed up just long enough to say no
Thu Nov 20, 2025, 02:06 AM
9 hrs ago

and went home. It's not like the Ukrainians are going to allow partition and occupation, something that just never works out well for anyone and some history Putin would do well to review. Even if Ukraine were forced into this idiocy by the rest of the world, I can promise you that the people in the occupied areas would bleed Russia dry.

Wonder Why

(6,392 posts)
4. Wouldn't surprise me at all to find that King Fat Pig came up with the idea then TACO'd when his aides said he was nuts!
Thu Nov 20, 2025, 11:31 AM
30 min ago
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