However, I have no respect for people who think running away solves any problems. The problems plaguing this country are being spread or have spread to other countries.

I have a name for these people, but I won't say it here.

an acronym would at least give us a hint. And by the way, I don't give a flying F where people choose to live... it's their choice.

But go for it!

Were they wrong????

People have a right to exist on their own terms, without the government de-personing them.
We all know where that leads, and we're on that road now.

People first need to take care of themselves, both physically and emotionally. It is impossible to solve anyone else's problems if you are not safe. For many brown people and LGBT people (especially trans women), being physically and emotionally safe is a near-impossibility in this country. If running away allows one to be safe - and one is able to - it may be the best thing they can do.

leave and be Where They Want to BE.

the US doesn't have universal healthcare or gun control, & has a shredded social safety net.

That's why trump and the gop won't mind.

I am ambivalent about Americans who are able to retire abroad, fleeing to comfort. My perspective is that of a longtime volunteer for the local Democratic Party. One of the seemingly insurmountable problems of local organized has been that people with advanced degrees and organizational skills have largely avoided getting involved. Absent such participation, the party is less effective than it could or should be. Mediocrity becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Not being retired, I wouldn't know about that part, and maybe in Latin America it's comfortable living on an American pension or Social Security check, but here in Western Europe (possibly excepting Portugal), the cost of living is higher than in the USA, and anyone living in Germany gets their SS taxed in Germany, full rate and no 15% exclusion, either.

Besides, Democrats abroad, as long as they are U.S. citizens, can still vote absentee, campaign locally (Democrats Abroad, Germany, of which I am a member, is very active, from the Ostsee to the Bodensee) and make contributions up to the legal limit. What contributes more to mediocrity, an educated professional lending time to public Democrats Abroad events on the streets of London, Paris or Berlin, or someone parading around some American college campus with a hand-painted sign saying "tax the rich" or some other equally original slogan? Sure, there will be some Americans abroad who tune out, and are comfortably retired in a cozy bungalow in Cuernavaca. Most Americans abroad bear no resemblance to that image.

Trust me on this. If you need organizational skills, look for women who've organized PTA events, church suppers, and fundraising events. Those people have proven organizational skills.

JD Vance made the comment in a private Facebook message to his former law school roommate, Josh McLaurin, in 2016. In the message, which was shared in 2022, Vance wrote:

"I go back and forth between thinking Trump is a cynical a–hole like Nixon who wouldn't be that bad (and might even prove useful)
or that he's America's Hitler."

Oh....... THAT----- possibly the last time Vance told the truth---
before he sold his soul for political power!!!!


But of course, those U.S. citizens don't flee America based upon Vance's old quote,
but upon Trump's and maggot Republicans more recent actual DEEDS!

and fight the good fight.

So, I learned her language and the languages of most surrounding countries (Europe is not very big), and told my employer when I was hired at age 23 that I needed to spend more time in Europe than the usual two weeks of vacation. Always a progressive thinker, he said hey, make yourself useful and take all the time you want.

It’s not a paradise here. The weather sucks. There is punishing bureaucracy, public transportation that is rarely on time, and double taxation. “Free” education and “free” health care are myths. NOTHING is free, although some things are financed in a completely different manner. The bureaucracy here invades EVERY aspect of everyone’s life here. You can’t tell an EU bureaucrat “that’s none of your goddam business,” because in the EU, it probably is. “Privacy” is a four letter word in the EU.

There are some differences that are positive, of course. Police brutality is rarer (police indifference and corruption are not). It is FAR more difficult to obtain a firearm, and if you do not pass regular inspections, the authorities WILL take away guns kept by offenders. Due to open borders and short distances, however, organized crime brings in all the weapons they want by car from eastern EU countries with loose controls and poorly paid cops.

Most countries have intact welfare systems, but they are stretched to the breaking point, and were not designed to accommodate people from outside their countries wanting a free ride. Unless you are good at cheating the system, welfare here does not provide for a life of comfort, and if you smoke or are alcoholic, you might find yourself going hungry the last couple of days of the month. My wife was a life-long social worker, and faced this every day. Local train stations are full of beggars, most of whom are locals (some foreigners, of course, especially exploited/enslaved women from Balkan countries).

There are always hundreds of reasons to move to a different country. Most boil down to three general categories: personal, political or professional, and often a combination of two of them. Phony marriages of convenience are the first thing immigration authorities look for, so don’t even consider it.

My own small story started out as personal which quickly became professional as well. Americans are welcomed in Europe IF they have their own money, their own job, their own health insurance, and speak the language of the country they seek to move to. Imagine some 30 year old guy wanting to move from Düsseldorf to Philadelphia when he has $3000 to his name, no place to live, no job prospects, no health insurance, and the only language he can speak is German. That’s just about how welcome a 30 year old guy from Philadelphia, speaking only English, would be, when asking to move to Düsseldorf.

IF you are blessed with ancestry that allows you dual citizenship, and you want the option, I say what the hell, go for it. I know an American woman who wanted to live in Belgium, but had no legal basis for a residence permit. But she found that one of her grandfathers was born in Luxembourg after January 1, 1900. Under Luxembourg law, that made her eligible for citizenship there. It took her a year and two trips to Luxembourg, but she got her dual citizenship, is now fluent in French, and living full time in Belgium. EU citizens are permitted to live anywhere in the EU.


Both of my daughters were born and grew up here in Germany. I got them both US citizenship at birth. Both went to college in the USA. One stayed on, and the other got a job offer she couldn’t refuse in Germany, and so moved back. Both daughters each had two children, and though the process is far more cumbersome now than it was when I got them their US citizenship (one day for each of them in the 1980s, eleven months each for their children within the last eight years), all my grandchildren are now dual citizens.

We have all been fortunate enough not to find ourselves in situations so intolerable that one of us feels that “I cannot take this any longer, and I MUST leave.”

But we have not spent any time in the shoes of anyone who feels differently, and therefore have neither encouragement nor condemnation for anyone who makes the move, is contemplating it, or can’t but wishes they could. Everyone has their own story, and it’s not my place to tell it for them.

Clearly things have changed, especially with the internet that facilitates movement and also exploitation.

I’ve traveled overseas quite a bit in the last year and everywhere I go, people are telling this American why they won’t travel to the United States. The latest was a Canadian who had had her phone searched at a Washington state border crossing.

Now he can't get back in the US.

By "touched", I mean lower IQ. He's gay and I believe he fled with his SO because his SO was likely to be deported by Trump. While in Africa, he ran out of eplilepsy medicine and can't get it in Africa. (It's a country in Africa that would not be considered a "destination", is it Nigeria??) Well, because his epilepsy is not controlled, they will not let him fly home. So he's stuck in Africa in a country that hates gays, with epilepsy that is not controlled. (For some reason, something about him being gay is the reason he hasn't been able to get his meds or see a doctor) It's just a nightmare.

It's weird.

I think the guy really doesn't want to leave because, he could probably get help getting home at a US consulate or if he contacted his US senator or congressional rep.

Is life here perfect...of course not. That is not available anywhere. But, the weather is close to perfect where we live. Pace of life is appealing and the cost of living is probably about half of the US.

We have no kids so that makes it easier. We visit friends in the US from time to time and vice versa.

We have never been touched by violence. We had a few Oxxo stores burned last week because the cartel is angered. Things are back to normal.

I've lived out of the US three times during my life. One year in Belgium, one year in Germany and six months in Mexico previously. Always enjoyed the experience. When we retired my wife said she wanted an adventure. We looked at several places in the US and abroad. After visiting here my wife said let's do it.

I care about what happens to the US, but understand that home is with my wife and beautiful animals where ever that may be.

Tourist destinations like Cancun and Acapulco are controlled by three cartels!

Still whatever works for you.

Could it happen...sure. But, we know what areas to avoid. In the states the violence, mass murders are random. except the ones by ICE.

I've got friends in Puerto Vallarta

How is public transportation? It doesn't exist
How are the side walks? Bad (I'm not young)

When I look at construction in Mexico, it doesn't meet ADA standards. And by that I mean, staircases are narrow. Steps might be too steep. Stuff like that.

These guys are young.

Lake Chapala is a US retirement community and they probably meet our standards. However, Mexico is not cheap anymore. And a 1,000 sq ft 2 bedroom is going for $260,000. Which is what you would pay in the US. But you need to pay cash in MX.
So, either gotta sell your home here or have $260,000 on-hand.

https://choosechapala.com/property/casa-paz/

It just doesn't sound all that easy to me.....

My best friend and I, who already owned a house together, just moved to the Lake Chapala area a year ago. We bought a house down here and will never move back. We love it here. We do have family and friends in the states so worry about what is happening there, and 2 of my 3 kids are there with the other in Denmark. The recent violence does not deter us since it is not targeted towards us and things are already pretty much back to normal. I do hate seeing the Mexican people here hurt by the violence because it affects their livelihoods when their businesses and their jobs are lost.

area a couple of years ago with his wife. Retired pediatrician from Washington state. They love it.

Wanda and Herb.

… even if I’m retired (which I can’t do—probably ever). I’d prefer Scotland, but that’s even less doable.

If my son wasn’t so resistant to winter, I’d be sorely tempted. I still am. Transcribed for a big hospital in Toronto and I have no doubt I would LOVE it there (Canada, not the city). *sigh*

Meet immovable object. Once I'm down for good they can ship my bones wherever they fit. I'm Gen X, and honestly never really had any faith in a nice retirement, soft landing, a long life or a simple road. I put in the hours, but figured there's always a catch. Trump is just par for the course in a long line of a-holes messing up the plan I was told to follow. YMMV

And I think that most people in marginalized communities have as well. I know a lesbian couple who are moving to Canada. I've heard trans friends talk about doing the same. And a lot of Pagans as well. I have one college friend who now has Croatian citizenship, but is staying for now.

We have a couple of things holding us back. Mostly people depend on us. Our cat rescue. Some low-income senior friends that we help out once a month with shopping. While my elderly aunt insists that she doesn't want my help, I can see that day coming. Also, my MIL down in Florida may need our help. Besides, every time I think about leaving, I remember my grandparents and great-grandparents who came to this country after much worse conditions. It's my duty to stay and fight as long as I can.

Cost of living is less and many Americans live there

“A Gallup poll last year found 40% of American women, ages 15-44, would like to permanently move overseas, if possible.”

Right wing male politicians keep taking away our rights, no wonder many young women are fed up with this country.