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AverageOldGuy

(3,187 posts)
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 11:44 AM Wednesday

The "Epstein Files" will never see the light of day

There are two reasons the "Epstein Files" now in possession of DOJ will never be released to the public.

ONE. "Pocket veto." If the President does not sign the bill passed by Congress within ten days of receiving it, and, if within those ten days Congress adjourns and does not reconvene until their next session, the bill is vetoed -- it's known as the "pocket veto" -- the President sticks it in his pocket and kills it. Congress is about to go out on holiday break, never to return until January 2026.

TWO. "Ongoing investigation." DOJ policy -- not statue -- says DOJ can withhold from public release material pertinent to a "ongoing investigation." AG Bondi has announced she is opening "investigations" into contacts between Epstein and Bill Clinton, Larry Summers, and a number of other Democrats. Don't be surprised to hear the opening of these "investigations" announced today or tomorrow, thereby closing the door on the release.

I'm surprised that people like Lawrence O'Donnell are celebrating the passage of the bill, because they should know better. I am one of Lawrence's biggest fans but he was about to pee in his pants last night, he was so happy about passage of the bill. Why he didn't warn us of the ways Trump can kill the bill I'll never know.

23 replies = new reply since forum marked as read
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The "Epstein Files" will never see the light of day (Original Post) AverageOldGuy Wednesday OP
Not the actual version..................... Lovie777 Wednesday #1
He can also flood the zone with "leaks" about any non-republicans involved unblock Wednesday #2
Files will be incomplete, redacted and doctored; Trump will not release any self-incriminating information. sop Wednesday #3
a doctored version hiding republicans will samsingh Wednesday #4
I agree John Coktosten Wednesday #5
Either way it's damaging... lame54 Wednesday #6
There will be independent Epstein information coming. Not just what's in the Area 51 DOJ vault. usonian Wednesday #7
When something passes virtually unanimously, it would easily be passed again EdmondDantes_ Wednesday #8
This whole thing is just a repeat of the mueller report Alpeduez21 Wednesday #9
Therefore... 2naSalit Wednesday #10
I found it ironic D_Master81 Wednesday #11
Yes, as in the "never-ending IRS audits" Zambero Wednesday #13
I think it's more likely that once he knew he couldn't stop the vote EdmondDantes_ Wednesday #17
Is a "pocket veto" subject to an override vote? Zambero Wednesday #12
Congress hasnt officially gone out of session for a long time Arazi Wednesday #20
No. A pocket veto totally kills a bill. It's a legal maneuver to avoid accountability. Wiz Imp Wednesday #21
Pam Bondi just used the open investigation excuse Arazi Wednesday #14
MaynBe so , but there's plenty of people that know the true story Tribetime Wednesday #15
People already believe he is hiding something. mwmisses4289 Wednesday #16
Well, here's the deal. The American people put a rapist/pedophile in the White House to preside over the nation. RedWhiteBlueIsRacist Wednesday #18
Recess - not Adjournment JustAnotherGen Wednesday #19
The bill (now LAW) itself addresses the "ongoing investigation" issue Wiz Imp Wednesday #22
It's trump's ankle-shackle until the end of term Torchlight Wednesday #23

Lovie777

(21,229 posts)
1. Not the actual version.....................
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 11:52 AM
Wednesday

American people want the truth, but the continue investigation will keep it center.

Unfortunately the one sided investigations won't include the fact that shithole is a dirty man-child, but the American people know better.

unblock

(55,816 posts)
2. He can also flood the zone with "leaks" about any non-republicans involved
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 11:53 AM
Wednesday

Keep the focus on any famous democrats he can smear.

And it will work, to some extent, for a while. The media will insist they can't ignore those stories, even if, as is so often the case, they come without a shred of evidence.

sop

(16,967 posts)
3. Files will be incomplete, redacted and doctored; Trump will not release any self-incriminating information.
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 11:58 AM
Wednesday

John Coktosten

(107 posts)
5. I agree
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 12:04 PM
Wednesday

Was thinking these things as well. If some version of the files are ever released it will be heavily redacted and edited.

usonian

(22,647 posts)
7. There will be independent Epstein information coming. Not just what's in the Area 51 DOJ vault.
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 12:12 PM
Wednesday
https://www.democraticunderground.com/100220810679
👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆👆

Look on the bright side, please.

All the noise may be meaningless but it keeps the issue in front.
Burying it was the entire point of every single insane action he's taken since January.
He can win a battle, but the war is lost to him and all the oligarchs who were part of the world's biggest scandal ever.

EdmondDantes_

(1,185 posts)
8. When something passes virtually unanimously, it would easily be passed again
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 12:12 PM
Wednesday

If he still won't sign it, that just increases pressure.

Alpeduez21

(1,990 posts)
9. This whole thing is just a repeat of the mueller report
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 12:13 PM
Wednesday

Lots of hype lots of expectations lots of talk of the down fall of trump. Lots that will just be redacted or completely lied about by a corrupt justice department

2naSalit

(99,086 posts)
10. Therefore...
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 12:19 PM
Wednesday

The value in this particular exercise will be that it shines a glaring beam onto those who are in the business of protecting the pedophile network of wealthy and powerful men and women who need to be held to account. EU countries don't fuck around and they have a far higher success rate in bringing the wealthy and powerful to account, including prison time and massive record-breaking fines than we have here for the past few decades.

I'm ready for it, shit, I'll even brush up on my reading comprehension skills in a couple languages just for the fun of it so I can read the news abroad better.

D_Master81

(2,311 posts)
11. I found it ironic
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 12:26 PM
Wednesday

That after stalling and fighting the release for months Trump comes out and says vote for it and it basically passes unanimously a couple days later. Something seems off. Is it because the files have been redacted? I doubt it, too many people have seen them that would know. I think it’s because of the ongoing investigations Trump knows they aren’t going to be released in full.

Zambero

(9,904 posts)
13. Yes, as in the "never-ending IRS audits"
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 12:33 PM
Wednesday

"I'll release the tax returns as soon as the audits are concluded".

EdmondDantes_

(1,185 posts)
17. I think it's more likely that once he knew he couldn't stop the vote
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 01:13 PM
Wednesday

He decided to champion it. Reagan opposed the MLK Jr holiday but once it passed with veto proof majorities he made a pretty speech about how great it was to honor MLK Jr.

Zambero

(9,904 posts)
12. Is a "pocket veto" subject to an override vote?
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 12:31 PM
Wednesday

A two-thirds Congressional majority can override a "conventional" presidential veto.

Arazi

(8,612 posts)
20. Congress hasnt officially gone out of session for a long time
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 01:43 PM
Wednesday

To prevent shenanigans.

Both sides have done this

Wiz Imp

(8,299 posts)
21. No. A pocket veto totally kills a bill. It's a legal maneuver to avoid accountability.
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 02:53 PM
Wednesday

Arazi

(8,612 posts)
14. Pam Bondi just used the open investigation excuse
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 12:34 PM
Wednesday

I think that’s the one they agreed to use

Tribetime

(6,994 posts)
15. MaynBe so , but there's plenty of people that know the true story
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 12:42 PM
Wednesday

So if he blocks the files , people will come out with what's in them

mwmisses4289

(2,847 posts)
16. People already believe he is hiding something.
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 01:04 PM
Wednesday

If he does either of the things the original op suggests, people will believe that is a sign screaming "GUILTY!!"

RedWhiteBlueIsRacist

(1,548 posts)
18. Well, here's the deal. The American people put a rapist/pedophile in the White House to preside over the nation.
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 01:24 PM
Wednesday

That says all you need to know about the United States and its worthless Christian values. Trump can stick the files down there in his Florida hillbilly mansion's bathroom. He and the GOP can't hide what he is.

JustAnotherGen

(37,403 posts)
19. Recess - not Adjournment
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 01:28 PM
Wednesday

We also have eye witness accounts -

At some point -

The women can start naming names, dates, and descriptions of genitals.

All's fair and whatnot.

Wiz Imp

(8,299 posts)
22. The bill (now LAW) itself addresses the "ongoing investigation" issue
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 03:09 PM
Wednesday

From the actual text of the bill:

(c) Permitted withholdings.—

(1) The Attorney general may withhold or redact the segregable portions of records that—

(A) contain personally identifiable information of victims or victims’ personal and medical files and similar files the disclosure of which would constitute a clearly unwarranted invasion of personal privacy;

(B) depict or contain child sexual abuse materials (CSAM) as defined under 18 U.S.C. 2256 and prohibited under 18 U.S.C. 2252–2252A;

(C) would jeopardize an active federal investigation or ongoing prosecution, provided that such withholding is narrowly tailored and temporary;


The language in the bill was crafted very carefully on purpose. Note the law only allows withholding info as part of a federal investigation, if the withholding is narrowly tailored and temporary.

That means they can not just put out a blanket claim that all the files can't be released because they are part of a federal investigation. Only files relevant to a very narrowly focused investigation can be withheld and even then, only temporarily - not until the end of time.

Massie has made it clear that he intends to hold the administration accountable to follow the specifics in the law and will sue immediately if/when they don't. Yes, that may take some time to resolve (if it comes to that), but I'm confident it will ultimately result in the courts forcing the files to be released.

Torchlight

(6,152 posts)
23. It's trump's ankle-shackle until the end of term
Wed Nov 19, 2025, 03:13 PM
Wednesday

and my guess is it prevents him from wielding the same amount leverage he had only two months ago, and that handful will only get smaller.

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