collecting personal information beyond what is needed for the transaction.

Paypal is such a simple transaction, I'm going to have to watch to see where I'm using it. I know I use it for ebay, and also, I think, some medical payments.

Will they have longer reach than just the transaction? Can they collect your browsing information to other sources?

I never go through PayPal.

Personally I have a small balance credit card ($800?) that allows me to avoid using our backing account debt card.

On and NEVER use your PIN at a store in person. Kroger requires it if you want cash back but not only do they charge you for it you have to use your PIN.
When stores like Target have gotten hacked the only information obtained was from customers who entered a PIN. If you run it as a credit, your information is much safer

photo id? All the rest? Are you saying they will demand that account holders provide this? Yeah, right...
Surely they know they will be told to go Fuck Off?

Feel free to tell them that.

But, don't be surprised when they ignore you and the others that feel this way.

They're rolling in it. They don't care about us.

And, yes, they will all be doing this before too long, even your local bank. (Such as requiring you to use your phone to access you account because cards are 'too easily lost'... like the damned phone is not?? Their desire to put everything about you on your phone is about as stupid an idea as I have ever heard of. 'Hey, let's put every single scrap of pertinent and sensitive data about you in one place... a place that is easily stolen and/or hacked!' Fucking idiots.)

Ain't technology wonderful?

I am not saying it won't happen. I'm not saying many many are not trying to MAKE it happen. I'm not saying what we saw with DOGE was not the entry point.

I AM saying I want to know the DOCUMENTED facts so that we have SOME chance of RESPONDING.

As they combat fraud. For instance, facial or touch recognition is one method of authentication for Login.gov, which you use to login into sites such as Social Security.

data. Fingerprints, yes, and I don't like that, but they have been on file due to my employment for decades.

So if you have a VALID source that PAYPAL is going to legally be able to acquire that biometric information from whatever source (Apple, Google, government, TSA, or other), I want to see it.

Again, the required disclaimer before you scream through your computer at me, I don't put anything past this administration in terms of what they MIGHT allow. But what is already KNOWN and DOCUMENTED is overwhelming. If you want to add THIS to it, then provide the damned documentation.

We're trying to answer your questions and you will get better responses if you act in a polite and professional manner.

Here are the changes, and the source. Please note the frequent use of "voluntary".

https://www.paypal.com/us/legalhub/paypal/privacy-full#:~:text=Biometric:%20When%20you%20consent%20in,%E2%80%9CPrivate%E2%80%9D%20at%20any%20time.

Key changes regarding biometrics
Expanded data collection terms: The privacy statement now explicitly mentions the collection of "voice identification, photo identification, or face scans".

Purpose of biometric collection: This data is used for identity verification and authentication related to high-security actions, including:
Recovering passwords
Updating profile information
Managing payments and payment methods
Lifting account limitations
Initiating cryptocurrency transfers

Voluntary verification process: In a separate help article, PayPal clarifies that a new biometric identity verification process is offered to individual customers for enhanced security. This involves scanning a government-issued photo ID and taking a selfie to confirm identity. Customers can opt out and use an alternative verification method via a computer.

Requirement for consent: The collection of biometric information is based on user consent within the PayPal app.

Data retention policies: Reportedly, PayPal may retain biometric data for up to three years after an account is closed, though users have raised privacy concerns about this.

answering my question, but far closer to the former. You have now, however, tried to do so, and I DO appreciate it. Your pulling out these updates does address some of it:

And this consent can be given through the options within your account.

As to your general question about acquiring data elsewhere, the issue is that there is a web of legislation out there dealing with biometrics and privacy, so there is no single source that will answer your question. For instance, the Driver's Privacy Protection Act (DPPA) of 1994 forbids the sharing of details of your driver's license, to include photo, except under limited circumstances.

More generally, the The Privacy Act of 1974 restricts the dissemination of personal records without your personal consent.

https://www.justice.gov/opcl/overview-privacy-act-1974-2020-edition

There is no national law (several states have passed such legislation, however) specifically regulating the collection and use of biometric data by private companies but privacy laws in general require consent. The issue in the past is that sometimes that consent was buried in boilerplate language in agreements people rarely read.

In short, it's complicated. My take on Pay Pal is not that they are making changes, but clarifying existing policies.

because they put it on the internet themselves.

That's the reason. Random photos, videos, and online images are generally not useful for a biometric database. Passport photos don't have to be professionally done, but there are parameters to make them "scannable" for valid identification purposes.

Here is a link to the current privacy policy: https://www.paypal.com/us/legalhub/paypal/privacy-full

Categories of Personal Information collected from you, including from your interactions with us and use of the Services ersonal Identifiers: Such as Name, Business Name, Address, Phone Number, Email, IP address, Device Information, Information collected from cookies or other tracking technologies, other information necessary to establish an account or profile.
Records and Financial Information: Such as, bank account and routing numbers, credit and debit card information, amount you send or request, other financial information.
Transaction and Experience Information: Such as online shopping cart information, shopping activity and goods or services considered on Partners and Merchants sites, shipping options and associated costs when you check out, purchase history, and order tracking and product information.
Geolocation: We may collect IP-based geolocation data and Global Positioning System (GPS) with your consent during your user experience or based on your mobile application settings.
Internet or network activity: interactions with our Services, Information about response time for web pages, download errors, date and time when you used the service, Location Information, such as your IP address, statistics regarding how pages are loaded or viewed, the websites you visited before coming to the Sites and other usage and browsing information collected through Cookies (“Technical Usage Data”).
Biometric: When you consent in the user experience, we collect voice identification, photo identification, or face scans to verify your identity and authenticate you for certain actions related to your account, including, for example, verify your identity and authenticate you to meet regulatory requirements or before you access accounts and Services, recover passwords, update profile info, manage payments and payment methods, lift account limitations, and initiate cryptocurrency transfers.
Audio, electronic, visual, or similar information: Call recordings when you talk to customer service.
Professional or employment information: including business information, job title, contact emails, phone numbers and taxpayer ID numbers.
Imported Contact Information: including name, address, phone number, images, email address or usernames associated with the contacts.
PayPal Account Profile Information: username, profile picture, gender, or personal description which you add that may include sensitive personal information. You can set your profile to “Private” at any time.
Information you provide when you contact us: Your response to surveys, recorded conversations, chat conversations with us, email correspondence with us, account or profile status, repayment history, voice identification, Information about others if you choose to share it with us.
Inferred data: We may infer information about you such as your preferences and shopping behavior, based on your transactions and interactions with our Services or with our Partners and Merchants.
Characteristics of Protected Classifications: including age or date of birth, national origin, disability, citizenship, military status.
Sensitive Personal Information: Social Security number, government-issued identification, bank account and routing numbers, credit and debit card information, voice identification and Photo IDs or Precise Geolocation.
Information from your device: including, language settings, browser ID, cookie preferences, time zone, operating system, platform, screen resolution and similar information about your device settings, data collected from cookies or other tracking technologies.
We may also obtain the above categories of Personal Information from the following categories of sources:


And here is a link to the updated policy that takes effect in November: https://www.paypalobjects.com/marketing/ua/pdf/US/en/privacy-full-111725.pdf

Categories of Personal Information collected from you, including from your interactions with us and use of the Services:
• Personal identifiers: Such a same, business name, address, phone number, email, IP address, device information, information collected from cookies or other tracking technologies, government-issued identification, signature, and other information necessary to establish an account or profile.
• Records and financial information: Such as identity card numbers, government-issued identification, account header information, bank account and routing numbers, credit and debit card information, income, amount you send or request, your payment instrument, card, financial or funding account in connection with the Services, including issuer name, card type, country code, payment account number, CVV, username, and IBAN information.
• Transaction and experience information: Such as account balances, transaction history and transaction details, online shopping cart information, transaction ID, shopping activity and goods or services considered on Partners and Merchants sites, shipping address, shipping options and associated costs when you check out, purchase history, seller information, such as seller name, industry and postal code, buyer information, purchase information, and order tracking and product information.
• Commercial information: Such as payout amount, payor information, and the record of the Services.
• Geolocation data: Such as Global Positioning System (“GPS”), which we may collect with your consent if you have an account for financial Services, and IP-based geolocation data during your user experience or based on your mobile application settings.
• Internet or network activity: Such as interactions with our Services, information about response time for web pages, download errors, date and time when you used the service, shopping history, location information, such as your IP address, statistics regarding how pages are loaded or viewed, the websites you visited before coming to the Sites, and other usage and browsing information collected through Cookies.
• Biometric data: Such as voice identification, photo identification, or face scans, which we may collect when you consent in the user experience to authenticate you for certain actions related to your account, including, for example, to verify your identity before you access accounts and Services, recover passwords, update profile information, manage payments and payment methods, lift account limitations, and initiate cryptocurrency transfers.

• Audio, electronic, visual, or similar information: Such as call recordings when you talk to customer service.
• Professional or employment information: Such as business information, job title, contact emails, phone numbers and taxpayer ID numbers.
• Imported contact information: Such as name, address, phone number, images, email address or usernames associated with the contacts you import or enter manually.
• Account profile information: Such as username, profile picture, gender, or personal description, which you add that may include Sensitive Personal Information. You can set your profile to “Private” at any time.
• Information you provide when you contact us: Such as your responses to surveys, recorded conversations, chat conversations with us, email correspondence with us, account or profile status, repayment history, voice identification, vulnerability-related information provided by you and information about others if you choose to share it with us.
• Inferred data: Such as gender, income, browsing and purchasing habits, creditworthiness, fraud and risk assessment, your preferences and shopping behavior, which we may infer based on your transactions and interactions with our Services, ads and offers or with our Partners and Merchants.
• Information related to legal requirements: Such as information from external sanction lists, including name, date of birth, place of birth, occupation, and the reason why the person is on the external sanction lists in question, consistent with applicable law.
• Characteristics of protected classifications: Such as, age or date of birth, nationality, disability, citizenship, and military status.
• Sensitive Personal Information: Such as Social Security and tax ID number, government-issued and other related identification, bank account and routing numbers, credit and debit card information, financial information, biometric data (as described above), or precise geolocation data, depending on applicable privacy law. In certain jurisdictions (e.g. under the GDPR), this may also be referred to as “special category information”.
• Information from your device: Such as language settings, browser ID, device ID, device type, cookie preferences, time zone, operating system, platform, screen resolution, and similar information about your device settings, device’s web browser, and internal connection, and data collected from Cookies or other tracking technologies.

See my post above. I AM NOT saying these companies are not out of control. I want to know the facts asserted by an authoritative source on facial recognition. I also want to know what is being done to counter this. There ARE groups out there with such interest--not merely ACLU, Electronic Frontier Foundation, and many other privacy groups. Where is the info from THEM?

Biometric: When you consent in the user experience, we collect voice identification, photo identification, or face scans to verify your identity and authenticate you for certain actions related to your account, including, for example, verify your identity and authenticate you to meet regulatory requirements or before you access accounts and Services, recover passwords, update profile info, manage payments and payment methods, lift account limitations, and initiate cryptocurrency transfers.

(Note, if you have had any reason to visit some major jails on a regular basis (e.g., lawyers, public health officials, health care workers, friends, family) then you might have had to submit, but they are not supposed to store it long term upon your request for them to delete (yeah, I know... )

If you travel internationally regularly, that is a possibility, but those are out there. Neither facial recognition nor fingerprints, nor DNA, nor other common biometrics have been authorized to be shared commercially to my knowledge. If you have a valid source that counters this, I ask you to provide it.

Naturally, we are all concerned about the limitless assaults this administration MIGHT authorize, but there are enough of them- even well-publicized- to focus on without anticipating that which we can't confirm.

You don't have to use it. In fact, you don't have to prove your identity at all to use their services, although your account will be severely limited in what you can do with it.

While I have not consented to and have not set up facial recognition for PayPal I have voluntarily set up facial recognition’ on some apps, including one that lets me use an express entry line at the ballpark. Completely optional.

Fuck 'em.

I also can deposit money into my kid’s account as he still has his junior account at our CU. I do this for b’day, holidays. And I am on my mother’s bank account, so I just go to a branch in my town if I need to give her money (usually for just shared gift buying.)

I'm closing PayPal. Haven't used it in about 9 years.

part of the issue for financial companies is proving identification in an era of AI. I'm seeming a trend towards a scanned ID card of some sort and a selfie, all of which has to be submitted relatively quickly.

I used to use Pay Pal but now I rely solely on my credit card.

The account was accidentally acquired earlier this year while renewing my DU star membership.

I'd successfully used my credit card for DU before that, but must have hit the wrong button this year.

Never used paypal anyway, and am happy to be rid of it.

I don't recall what info I gave them to open it, but if I get asked for additional information I consider intrusive, I'll just cancel the account and sophisticate my online banking in the USA so that I can make the three or four transfers per year for which I use Paypal now.

I received a courtesy email this morning.

Never gave them any non-public info. I won't face scan with my phone for this reason. Unfortunately I had to do face and fingerprints for global entry. But my job had required them decades ago, anyway.

I've been wanting to do this for years anyway.

them and their parent company eBay, when they didn't refund me for something I bought from a fraudulent seller.

Never was actually sure what they did with personal info anyway. ...done fine without em.