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Related: Editorials & Other Articles, Issue Forums, Alliance Forums, Region ForumsThe whole stock market crash and recovery was a ruse to make billions
For the Rapist's buddies. The second the word "tariffs" left his lips, it crashed. And as soon as he talked about reducing them, it bounced back. Amazing the the words of a senile, crackpot can set the whole world on fire.

Scrivener7
(55,423 posts)Duncanpup
(14,328 posts)Economic concerns ahead as usual with a repig in office.
Yet this moron is just dumber than dog shit.
SheltieLover
(66,752 posts)

Duncanpup
(14,328 posts)NCDem47
(2,781 posts)He lives in the moment, so its up, its down, its up, its down. We all know the schtick.
Not sure about Wall Street, but Main Street isn't going to put up with it. They'll reign in and play very conservatively because the only thing that is ceratin is the the uncertainty with Trump, regardless if there's a quick buck to be made in the markets.
He is shown not to be a serious person to other countries and American businesses.
WVlaserguy
(87 posts)I sold out. Im done until this knuckle head is gone
Old Crank
(5,522 posts)The tax consequences at way to dire in my situation.
Since 80% is in taxable when withdrawn accounts and the German Finanzamt, IRS, will take 40% .
If people are thinking of relocating to Europe this might be a good time to move as much as you can to Roth IRA instruments.
You will have to pay US taxes when you do so, and wait 5 years, I think, before you can pull the money, but it become tax exempt from the conversion ate on.
Kid Berwyn
(20,039 posts)Track her trades with Quiver
https://www.quiverquant.com/congresstrading/politician/Marjorie%20Taylor%20Greene-G000596
dchill
(42,080 posts)Irish_Dem
(68,459 posts)Also the word on the street is that in addition to insider trading the the countries
forced to make tariff deals had to do business and invest in the Trump spawn's businesses.
DENVERPOPS
(11,839 posts)Since the one in Reagan's period.......Sell short, dump the market, pay off your sold stocks with much cheaper purchases, wait for all of us to build it back up, then repeat.......
Irish_Dem
(68,459 posts)Steals as much of tax payer funds and American resources as possible.
Dems always have to come in a do a clean up on aisle 14.
And fill up the piggy bank again.
DENVERPOPS
(11,839 posts)over the past 50+ years, the Repubs drive it down, sucking off the accomplishments of the Dems, then the Dem's Presidents build it back up, in a vicious cycle.........It looks like a roller coaster.............
Irish_Dem
(68,459 posts)DENVERPOPS
(11,839 posts)they will be backing up their Dump Truck sized Limos to Fort Knox......
Irish_Dem
(68,459 posts)DENVERPOPS
(11,839 posts)Trump DEMANDED he and Musk be allowed to personally tour Fort Knox...........SERIOUSLY!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Irish_Dem
(68,459 posts)Trump and Musk think they own everything.
DENVERPOPS
(11,839 posts)Musk and Trump are going to commandeer the entire BitCoin and Crypto supply. Then declare it the currency of the U.S.
The U.S. Government, to operate, will need a humongous supply of it.....which they will have to purchase from Trump and Musk, paying for it with all the gold in Fort Knox............
Have you seen a recent picture of the Oval Office Irish_Dem.......He has framed all kinds of shit (Literally) on all the walls in huge gold frames, with gaudy gold "things" on the Mantle and table tops, It is beyond trashy, sort of a "trailer park trashy" decor....
Irish_Dem
(68,459 posts)Looks like the Palace of Versailles meets bawdy house.
He even attached some of the gold to the antique WH fireplace in the Oval House.
Probably damaged it.
Can you imagine how he felt in Ft. Knox.
Had to be orgiastic for him.
Yes I think Musk, Trump and other billionaires are trying to figure out how to make
crypto the global standard. And of course they own it all.
DENVERPOPS
(11,839 posts)I would have figured he would have those large black felt paintings you can buy in Mexico, with nude voluptuous, well endowed, women painted on them......Maybe even ones with Melania painted on them, like all the nude pics she used to do for him......
Irish_Dem
(68,459 posts)Pictures of nudes and himself of course.
Celerity
(49,430 posts)Some the MAGAts and other shills were insanely claiming BTC could pay off the entire US national debt.
Bear in mind that there are only 21 million bitcoins possible ever, around 20 million have already been mined, and of that 20 million, 4 to 8 million are lost forever (via lost wallets, people who have died and did not leave the private keys to anyone, people who lost the private keys themselves, etc etc). Taking a conservative guess and saying 5 million are perma-lost, that leaves, atm, only 15 million or so out there. For the US to get to 3 million BTC, they would have to literally buy up 20% or so of all the bitcoins that will ever exist. They also can never come close to selling off 20% of the total supply without crashing the valuation to a massive level.
IF you take a pretty wildly optimistic valuation for BTC (I have seen a $3 million per BTC target by 2030) and assume that the US will end up with 1 million bitcoins (what the crypto bros are calling for), and then take that and and TRIPLE it (to 3 million BTC) that yields a gross valuation of only 9 trillion USD at $3m per BTC and the US somehow getting its hands on 3 million BTC.
The national debt will be over 40 trillion USD by 2030, probably far larger. 9 trillion USD (and that number is extraordinarily unlikely to be able to be realised via selling off the US holdings in toto or anywhere near in toto) will never come close to paying off that ever-increasing US national debt.
It is fantasy-land.
But let's go further......let's take it to a a fairly maximal future forward level.......................
By 2050 or so, counting unfunded liabilities, the US cumulative exposure could easily be closing in on 200 trillion USD (hard debt, plus unfunded liabilities, including massive transfers such as Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, etc).
Let's say that the US somehow (fantasy but let's play this out) ends up with HALF of all BTC that is available. Around 7.5 million bitcoins (and that is IF the number of perma-lost BTC stays at (or even is) only 5 million BTC lost, and that number (ie half of all BTC that is available) may well be, as time goes on, far too small, it may end up at 7 or even 8 million perma-lost BTC, reducing the 7.5m BTC US holding number (if we are saying the US holds HALF of all BTC) down to as low as 6 million BTC)
Let us also project an extraordinary 10 MILLION USD per BTC market valuation, and lets say the US DOES end up with 7.5 million BTC.
That 7.5 million BTC would have a GROSS value (if ALL were liquidated, which again is impossible for reasons stated before) of 75 trillion USD.
Nowhere near paying off the hard national debt (which if we go off current deficit rates, could be around 80 trillion USD by 2050) PLUS covering the the future unfunded liabilities (over 100 trillion USD atm).
And that is with my utterly profound fantasy-land projections of the US holding HALF of all of the entire BTC supply and a ONE HUNDRED-AND-SEVEN -FOLD increase in the price from its current 93,500 or so USD per BTC, plus some the US dumping all 7.5 million BTC it holds (which would eviscerate the entire market)
DENVERPOPS
(11,839 posts)explanation Celerity............fascinating.........
I said that scenario half-joking, but maybe you have some realistic thoughts on how Trump will loot Fort Knox.....We all know of his life time of adoring Gold........for his ludicrous display of wealth.........
Wealth and Gold are just two of the three things that help him offset his Psychological need to compensate for his TWPC
Celerity
(49,430 posts)per ounce, that is 490.2 billion USD in total value. Those 147.3 million ounces held at Fort Knox are a little over half of the total US gold reserves. So even IF the US liquidated ALL their gold reserves at the current price (impossible without battering the market to a significant degree) it would yield less than 1 trillion USD, which is less than the US governmental spends in toto in two months.
DENVERPOPS
(11,839 posts)have you been following that it has been decades since the gold at Ft.Knox has truly/actually been "Audited".....
(Not crazy/fanatical internet crap).......The last time a small "Portion" was truly "assayed" was like decades ago, and only a limited number of random ingots............ and every ingot actually counted, has been quite awhile, maybe several presidents ago?
Celerity
(49,430 posts)value (at current price) is actually (and this is mind-blowing) LESS than what one person, Musk, was worth on December 18th, 2024. That is when he when he briefly (per Bloomberg's valuation) passed the 500 billion USD mark in terms of his net worth. Forbes pegged him then at (if memory serves) 486 billion USD, in terms of his net worth. The price of gold was far less back then, so Musk was easily worth more than all the gold in Ft Knox at that point. Musk is now worth around 200 billion USD less (give or take 10 billion USD or so) than his all-time high. The Trumpian 2.0 regime has not been kind to Musk, and the berk can blame himself for much of his personal reversals of fortune.
I said all that to put the US dollar amount of the US gold reserves into perspective. It is small beer in the overall financial system's machinations.
ProfessorGAC
(72,378 posts)If the markets were that predictable,TSLA wouldn't be 67% than a year ago while there revenues were static then fell.
I believe that in his megalomania, he thought tariffs were a way to be the one to eliminate income taxes and be his ticket to Rushmore.
With the markets down 5%+ YTD, those "billions" for his cronies would fail to cover the losses.
Do they care more about money tank anything else? Sure. But, everything isn't a conspiracy and some of these superrich people just got lucky. It doesn't mean they have market brilliance.
Bernardo de La Paz
(54,817 posts)Without specific evidence I remain vaguely suspicious but I think incompetence explains it best for the time being, and has been best for some time.
Specific evidence is NOT Official A says B and market declines C. Nor Official D says E and market rises F. Nor is it hot mike comments in the Oval Office about mogul G making 500 million and mogul H making 9 billion without specific reference to time periods and actual moves. He may have been referring to general business gains since his election -- neither we nor the media know. Further the numbers referred to are not credible for possible market plays by those moguls in recent weeks; way too large.
stopdiggin
(13,610 posts)in place of the (too prevalent) "he said" speculation and conjecture.
misanthrope
(8,679 posts)I will admit to entertaining ideas that he was trying to manipulate the market for short-term gain. Your post reminds me that is far too complex an answer than incompetence.
CrispyQ
(39,504 posts)IDK how many months before the chaos shows, one, two? What happens when all those fired people are denied unemployment benefits cuz that's an expense we can't afford? And the ones who go back to offices that don't have desks or computers anymore. OMG, so much damage & harm done already. Also this
at those I know who voted for this GD shit.
bobalew
(366 posts)This really is nothing but crass market manipulation! Done by the one person actually capable of benefiting from it: Eloon. Just a word in Dumps ear, a short sale of other competitors stocks, and boom, billions made via insider manipulation. Yes trillion's lost by others. They have turned the market into a casino, with the oligarchy being the house guaranteed to win. This is the largest bank robbery in history in progress, run by a very criminal admin. Dump is most definitely a russian asset, disassembling the country apart per Putins bidding, as we stand & watch it happening, while the faithful MAGAs tell you its OK, awaiting their $5k DOGE refund checks in the mail, hoping all this chaos will die down. Well, it isnt, not until the orange rotted moron has completed his mission in trade for a hideous tower in Moscow, and a free ticket for his escape.
ProfessorGAC
(72,378 posts)You're the one tossing out speculation & insults.
If you're so sure of yourself you ought to be able to find evidence to support your claims of manipulation.
If you can't prove your contentions, quit insulting people.
DENVERPOPS
(11,839 posts)to be a sort of a REVERSE, PUMP and DUMP........
Selling "SHORT" wouldn't be such a money making adventure, if they had to fill the stock they "SOLD" immediately, instead of three days later.......
AND, of course ..... it would be wonderful if they ever prosecuted the un-fathomaable amounts of illegal "Insider Trading", but the SEC and DOJ are not real good at that either.......
DENVERPOPS
(11,839 posts)the HUMONGOUS amount of Insider Trading that went in one afternoon during the COVID Pandemic?????????????
Marthe48
(20,503 posts)it will happen over and over. The latest was speculation about ousting Jerome Powel. When it floated, the DJIA dropped 3%. When felon denied his intentions, the market rebounded 1000 pts. Watch for more ploys to fiddle the market. Cheating is what they do.
wolfie001
(4,675 posts)When the shit hits the fan, what will be left?
yourout
(8,409 posts)Prairie Gates
(4,907 posts)The Dow was over 45,000 in December and January.
The NASDAQ was over 20,000.
The S&P was over 6,100.
The major US indexes (and their relatively linked 401k plans) are all still down over 10% from their peaks.
Walleye
(39,752 posts)uponit7771
(92,746 posts)GoodRaisin
(10,120 posts)Coolgoober
(52 posts)And thought, was this the plan or is Trump an idiot? Well first of all I think Trump is an idiot 24/7. This guy is dumb as a rock. He's never done a fucking thing in his life. He's never had to. He's never made a PB&J sandwich. He's a moron. All he knows how to do is swindle. Oh, and there is one other thing. He know how to listen to the last person who told him something (not necessarily advise) and repeat it and do it and brag about how it was his idea. And that brings us back to, was it a plan? The answer is yes but it was not Trumps!
GreatGazoo
(4,131 posts)This bounce is just people pushing him to back us away from the cliff he led us to.
We haven't made it above pre "Liberation day" levels because the damage is done -- USD, trust, ill will, etc.
Bernardo de La Paz
(54,817 posts)A says B and market goes down C is not evidence of manipulation. Period.
Suspicion is not evidence.
Ponietz
(3,528 posts)For instance, where were you on the night that ___ happened? calls for circumstantial evidence. Circumstance is always relevant.
Law enforcement sometimes starts investigations on nothing but circumstance. Courts admit circumstantial evidence every day unless its more prejudicial than probative. Theres nothing prejudicial about this evidence. But, as you say, its not direct evidence, and by itself doesnt meet the legal threshold.
bif
(25,203 posts)And the people around him are just manipulating him. I think he's pretty out of it dementia-wise and he just barely knows what's going on. They're sending him out to play golf as much as they can to keep him from meddling.
stillcool
(33,659 posts)a wannabe actor, playing a part.
William769
(58,721 posts)Warpy
(113,237 posts)There's a lot of pumping and dumping going on along with massive short selling. IOW, the market has been destabilized and the vultures are out in force, so be careful if you're still buying and selling. You can't compete with HFT and in a market like this one, it's easy to get burned to a crisp.
What these stupid people didn't expect is the blow up in the bond market. They're shocked--shocked, I tell you--that a loss of faith in this country as a rational trading partner has translated into a loss of faith in this country's currency.
It's hard to fathom how monumentally stupid these people are.
FadedMullet
(61 posts)Walleye
(39,752 posts)Iamscrewed
(113 posts)It's called insider trading.
republianmushroom
(19,546 posts)A flex of power.
stopdiggin
(13,610 posts)and neither has the market 'recovered'
The most accurate part of this post comes in the final sentence.
It's F-ing incompetence (written in capital letters) - not some sort of brilliant game plan.
stillcool
(33,659 posts)is play golf. To think that he had the knowledge to do anything else is ludicrous. My God, all the people around him who have been making these plans for years. Not a brilliant game plan, but absolutely a well thought out plan long in the making.
stopdiggin
(13,610 posts)the stock market (plus the dollar and treasury notes) fiasco ... Nope. You're not going to sell me on any brilliant strategy there. Just miserable incompetence.
stillcool
(33,659 posts)cause and effect. Hell, I don't know...you could very well be right, and I could maybe be a little bit wrong...
Doodley
(10,756 posts)What we have heard from Trump about deals being made, lower china tariffs, and no intention of firing Powell is BS. It's an idiot panicking about his own credibility, not manipulation.
twodogsbarking
(13,400 posts)future will bring. When the future is bleak expect anything. Couple all that with no accountability and pissing off our greatest allies and countries we do the most business with and my pessimism increases. On the humanitarian side the US sucks even worse. Not the country 'tis of thee that I want.
spanone
(138,810 posts)Johonny
(23,404 posts)WarGamer
(16,990 posts)Martin Eden
(14,162 posts)But the Rethug majority is more likely to be in on the grift than to seek indictments for these crimes.
That includes AG Pam Blondie.
republianmushroom
(19,546 posts)And a flex of power.
Old Crank
(5,522 posts)Money is made and lost on every throw of the dice.
It doesn't matter where the value level is if you have someone in power willing to manipulate the values.
If people in the know see Trump about to do something that might drop the value they quietly sell stock. Stocks drop on his announcement. Now they quietly buy back in before he makes a change. Up go the stock's price. Now they hold the same amount as before and have pocketed the the difference.