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hvn_nbr_2

(6,670 posts)
Tue Apr 22, 2025, 10:13 PM Tuesday

MAGA epistemology

Epistemology is the branch of philosophy that seeks to know how we know things, how we can determine what is true and even what is real. It might seem odd to be talking about epistemology here, but it turns out that MAGA epistemology explains a lot about why MAGAs think like they do. MAGA epistemology is really quite simple: If they want to believe something, it's true. If they don't want to believe it, it's fake news. All the facts, figures, logic, and real-world observations that constitute "evidence" for a normal person are useless, meaningless, worthless nonsense to MAGAs. That's why people find it so frustrating to talk to MAGAs--anything that a normal person considers evidence is just useless drivel to them because their only determinant of reality is if they want to believe it.

That's how they can tell instantly that every detail of some lunatic wingnut conspiracy theory or fantasy is totally true. For instance: Hillary, along with George Soros and Bill Gates, eats live white Christian babies with taco sauce and drinks their blood while sitting on the veranda of her sex slave colony on Mars. It says something horrible about people they hate; therefore, they want to believe it; therefore, it's true, in every detail. There is absolutely no evidence of it; it's manifestly impossible. But reality factors have absolutely no use in their epistemology. They don't need to consider questions like: NASA doesn't know how to get humans to Mars and back, so how does Hillary do it? NASA doesn't know how to establish permanent human living on other planets, so how does Hillary do it? Why don't we ever hear about any billionaires (the only people who could afford a trip to Mars) disappearing for nine months at a time (minimum time to get to and from Mars) while they do their trip to Mars to boink 12-year-olds? And perhaps the biggest question of all, given what we now know was happening at the time these wacko stories started: Why would any billionaire spend nine months in a tin can traveling to Mars to boink a 12-year-old when Jeff Epstein was still having parties right here on earth?

MAGA epistemology explains why MuskOx and the DOGEkins come up with such outrageous conclusions about the places they break into. If they find something they don't understand, on the spur of the moment, they just make up the most evil conspiracy they can imagine, and then they KNOW that since they made it up, that makes it true. Ordinary MAGAs do that too. That's one of the exasperating things about trying to talk to MAGAs: they just make up stuff for which there is not any evidence whatsoever, but since they made it up, they know it's true. And when they say that they "do their own research," it simply means that they look for a wackadoodle website that tells them what they want to hear.

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MAGA epistemology (Original Post) hvn_nbr_2 Tuesday OP
Yup. Kick Eko Tuesday #1
Yep, you got it. rich7862 Tuesday #2
Well said !!! Karadeniz Tuesday #3
Simply put, Magical Thinking no_hypocrisy Tuesday #4
kicking HAB911 Yesterday #5
Absolutely true. You can trace the rise of Felon-47 through his increasing exploitation... Ol Janx Spirit Yesterday #6

Ol Janx Spirit

(152 posts)
6. Absolutely true. You can trace the rise of Felon-47 through his increasing exploitation...
Wed Apr 23, 2025, 11:53 AM
Yesterday

...of those that are vulnerable to this social dynamic. It was probably something he realized in his real estate business: many people--including banks and investors--would rather believe in a fantasy than languish in a reality. He proved very adept at selling the fantasy of himself as a successful businessman and figure of aspirational worth over the reality of being a sleazy self-dealing conman at the very least.

But when he landed on the conspiracy theory of Barak Obama being born in Kenya it started a new epistemic branch of conservative politics--one with him as the figurehead of an empire of grievance against the zeitgeist of the times. It wasn't a conspiracy theory of his own making, but he had a larger microphone than people like Orly Taitz ever had--and a lifelong education in lying.

Through this small open door he began to build his cult--asking for ever-larger shedding of previously-held beliefs. When almost the entire GOP went down the rabbit hole of John McCain not being a war hero it was a red flashing light to many of us that this was not a normal conservative movement. Had conventional GOP politicians who'd only a few years before backed McCain as their presidential candidate seen the same flashing red light then maybe we would not be here now--and they would not be relegated to whatever dustbin they find themselves in; or to kissing the ass of a man so unworthy of such an act.

Sadly, we flash forward from a time not so long ago when functions of the government were at least loosely-based on some shared reality between the parties. Now, half of the voting block--only roughly a third of eligible voters--have fallen under the spell of this cult and managed to install a government that adheres to their belief of the world rather than actual facts about it. We are at the point where many find themselves unable to question the cult leader on any point no matter how demonstrably untrue--and even at their personal loss.

How this happens is a fascinating subject intertwined with humanity itself and the role of sapiens' evolved ability to imagine the world around them and not just interpret the data presented to them. It explains the rise and persistence of religion; and the stunning fact that humans managed to walk on the moon.

An interesting paper on the dynamics of this for anyone interested:
https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/episteme/article/cults-conspiracies-and-fantasies-of-knowledge/CB17D336003DAA3A1B29BD54E4A43418

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